The Nested Observer Window Model Explained.

What if you are a pixel in a higher-level consciousness navigating through extra dimensions of time? Meet the 'Nested Observer Window Model' of Jonathan Schooler, PhD, who is Distinguished Professor of Psychological and Brain Sciences at the University of California Santa Barbara, Director of UCSB’s Center for Mindfulness and Human Potential, and Acting Director of the Sage Center for the Study of the Mind. In this video, Hans Busstra interviewed Schooler on his Nested Observer Window Model and how we need to extend physics to account for consciousness. Key papers related to the interview: Riddle J., Schooler J.W., 2024. "Hierarchical consciousness: the Nested Observer Windows model. Neuroscience of Consciousness." https://labs.psych.ucsb.edu/schooler/jonathan/publications/2676 Schooler J.W., Riddle J., 2024. "Three dimensions of time: An approach for reconciling the discrepancy between experienced time and modern physics. Possibility Studies and Society." https://labs.psych.ucsb.edu/schooler/jonathan/publications/2856 Jonathan Schooler’s META Lab: https://labs.psych.ucsb.edu/schooler/jonathan/ Our previous video with Schooler: https://youtu.be/2Bnktj5_o6M?t=7331&si=4HfCxc8mW4B86zFF Schooler’s presentation at The Science of Consciousness Conference in Barcelona: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=237hBe2Op7c Part I: Mind wandering and meta awareness 00:00:00 – Intro 00:02:58 – Jonathan on his work at the META Lab 00:04:31 – What is the function of mind wandering? 00:08:39 – The mind is not a single consciousness 00:11:01 – On conscious kidneys and tongues 00:14:07 – How the field of consciousness studies has dramatically shifte 00:16:46 – How mind wandering became a research topic Part II: On extending physics with extra dimensions of subjective time 00:17:59 – What led Jonathan into physics 00:24:37 – How physicists seem to step over certain questions 00:26:29 – On humbling new physics 00:28:46 – Extending the Einsteinian picture of the block universe 00:31:25 – Introducing a dimension of subjective time 00:33:17 – Why extra dimensions of time may be needed for free will 00:36:29 – Why we are not moving through time, but time is moving through us Part III: The Nested Observer Window Model 00:37:36 – The Nested Observer Window model 00:40:58 – The metaphysics of the “kite of consciousness” metaphor 00:43:56 – How lower levels of consciousness build up 00:46:33 – Resonance between different levels of consciousness 00:48:43 – Can we switch between higher and lower levels of consciousness? Part IV: The meaning of it all 00:51:28 – Psychedelic experiences and Jonathan’s work 00:56:16 – Spotlight vs. open awareness and childlike wonder 01:01:09 – On mind “wondering” 01:03:25 – Be open-minded, but not so open that your brain falls out 01:06:56 – Everyday “aha” moments 01:07:39 – How synchronicities fit in 01:10:21 – Finding the flow in life 01:13:35 – The difficulty of verifying parapsychology 01:17:22 – The Telepathy Tapes 01:20:44 – On entertaining without endorsing 01:22:16 – On Alan Watts’ “Hide and Seek” universe Interviews with Schooler on Closer to Truth: https://closertotruth.com/contributor/jonathan-schooler/ Copyright © 2025 Essentia Foundation. All rights on interview content reserved.