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Michael Nielsen – Why aliens will have a different tech stack than us

2026-04-07 Science & Technology
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Dwarkesh Patel
Dwarkesh Patel
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π„ππˆπ’πŽπƒπ„ π‹πˆππŠπ’ * Transcript: https://www.dwarkesh.com/p/michael-nielsen * Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/michael-nielsen-how-science-actually-progresses/id1516093381?i=1000760075027 * Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/episode/1JTv7Le8s5Mf0hDcXDOJYl π’ππŽππ’πŽπ‘π’ - Labelbox researchers built a new safety benchmark. Why? Well, current safety benchmarks claim that attacks on top models are successful only a few percent of the time, but the prompts in those benchmarks don't reflect how real bad actors actually write. You can read Labelbox's research here: https://labelbox.com/blog/the-ai-safety-illusion-why-current-safety-datasets-fool-us-on-model-safety/. If this could be useful for your work, reach out at https://labelbox.com/dwarkesh - Mercury has an MCP that lets you give an LLM access to your full transaction history, including things like attached receipts and internal notes. I just used it to categorize my 2025 transactions, and it worked shockingly well. Modern functionality like this is exactly why I use Mercury. Learn more at https://mercury.com - Jane Street's ML engineers presented some of their GPU optimization workflows at GTC, showing how they use CUDA graphs, streams, and custom kernels to shave real time off their training runs. You can watch the full talk here: https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/on-demand/session/gtc26-s82065/. And they open-sourced all the relevant code: https://github.com/janestreet/gtc2026/. If this kind of stuff excites you, Jane Street is hiring β€” learn more at https://janestreet.com/dwarkesh To sponsor a future episode, visit https://dwarkesh.com/advertise. π“πˆπŒπ„π’π“π€πŒππ’ 00:00:00 – How scientific progress outpaces its verification loops 00:17:51 – Newton was the last of the magicians 00:23:26 – Why wasn’t natural selection obvious much earlier? 00:29:52 – Could gradient descent have discovered general relativity? 00:50:54 – Why aliens will have a different tech stack than us 01:15:26 – Are there infinitely many deep scientific principles left to discover? 01:26:25 – What drew Michael to quantum computing so early? 01:35:29 – Does science need a new way to assign credit? 01:43:57 – Prolificness versus depth 01:49:17 – What it takes to actually internalize what you learn

Top Comments (10)

@EoleoV 2026-05-23

Such a beautiful conversation, every bit of it was interesting and insightful Thank you for inviting Michael Nielsen, it's an incredible guest

4
@DeletedImages 2026-04-07

Internalizing the interview afterwards as a lesson/ lecture is an amazing idea.

22
@yizhizhu5154 2026-04-07

The best way to think about low hanging fruit is that sometimes you discover new trees. Either through just going around exploring, or, by planting the seeds from the fruits you have eaten.

55 5 replies
@seanharveygoogle 2026-04-07

it would be interesting to see / hear a debate between mr nielsen and stephen wolfram on why these complex systems might simply be irreducible to some extent regardless of how many humans or how much compute we put against them.

20
@mikhailfranco 2026-04-08

Great conversation. Even if you do not appreciate all the scientific history, I recommend that _everyone_ (especially younger people) listen to the last ~15 minutes. It is a non-prescriptive rumination on how to maintain or manage: curiosity, discussion, specialization, networking, feedback, performance, burnout, rewards and _hope._

9
@kooperinterstellar-s2m 2026-04-09

Dwarvesh bro please please invite Gregory chaitin at least a couple of times. He is a mathematician and inventor of algorithmic information theory. His views on AGI, Creativity, humanity and future of science are amazing.

9
@alst4817 2026-04-08

Rocky’s tech stack is some metal wire

27
@Hyrumsabbath 2026-04-14

As a current math student, the last 10 minutes of the pod were such a treat.

2
@kauai-surf 2026-04-07

darn i was hoping for an 'Aliens will have a different Gelato recipe than us.' episode.

39 2 replies
@djames5432 2026-04-07

Blows my mind that on the question of why the theory of evolution by natural selection took so long relative to Newton's theories, in both this discussion and the one with Tao, religion doesn't enter the picture at all. For Tao it was about communication. Here you bring up the prerequisite concept of deep time. But religious thought was almost certainly the biggest blocker, indoctrinating everyone into conceiving of the world as a thing created by one or more deities, in its present state, relatively young. Religious thought also creates a hard line between humanity and the rest of life. These mental frameworks were an enormous impediment to understanding how life actually works, and it doesn't even occur to you guys. Simply bizarre.

5

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